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What drew me to joining this forum was the idea of ways for scientists, engineers and mathematicians to address the global ecological crisis, as well as the many other social, political and economic maladies, that seem to all be going parabolic. Having grown up as a closet intellectual in a non-academic sector of society and consequently looking at the current model from a bottom up point of view, I find many of these issues have evolved into their current state through a natural generational progression, where each age is more concerned with solving the problems with which it is faced, than really stepping back and trying to understand the underlaying cycle of cause and effect. For example, the social issues of morality and ethics seem to take for granted that good and bad are some cosmic conflict between the forces of righteousness and evil, rather than the basic biological binary of beneficial and detrimental. The 1/0 of sentience. Even bacteria get that. Any society will need some structure, in order to function, but it has to fluctuate between too restrictive and too fluid. More of a yin/yang situation, than the more monolithic models the West has inherited from monotheism. Humanity has evolved upwards, in terms of complex feedback and intricately evolved relationships. So when good is viewed as aspirational, rather than elemental, conflicts do become a race to the bottom, of us versus them. As all nuance and subjectivity is quickly polarized into conflicting sides. The logical fallacy of monotheism is that a spiritual absolute would be the essence of sentience, from which we rise, not an ideal of wisdom and judgement, from which we fell. The fact we are aware, than the details of which we are aware. The Ancients were not ignorant of monotheism, but as there was no separation between culture and civics, it signified more of an authoritarian monoculture, than some universal being. One people, one ruler, one god. Democracy and republicanism originated in pantheistic cultures, as they represented the multicultural, cosmopolitan societies that developed as tribal societies evolved into states. Rome adopted Christianity as it was fully settled into empire and any remnant of the Republic was shed. Though vestiges of pantheism remained, with the Trinity. Consequently the default political system for the West, for the next thousand+ years, was monarchy and feudalism. When the West went back to more populist forms of government, it required a separation of church and state, culture and civics. Though many of the ideologies that have developed since, also tend to see their ideals in absolutist terms and insist on a monocultural conformity to them. Even many supposedly rationally based systems tend to assume the good/bad dichotomy, as opposed to a more cyclical process of expansion and consolidation. Which also implicitly extends into how much of society functions, from compounding specialization, to the reduction of all broad social interactions to monetization, which is then assumed to be a commodity to mine from society, rather than the basic social contract enabling it. I could extend this line of thought out much further, including the idea that math is itself fundamentally emergent, along with the processes and patterns it models, rather than platonically ideal, but I'm putting this out there, to see if anyone is interested.